The proceedings are
reported in the language in which they were spoken in the
committee. In addition, a transcription of the simultaneous
interpretation is included. Where contributors have supplied
corrections to their evidence, these are noted in the
transcript.
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Dechreuodd y cyfarfod am 11:00.
The meeting began at 11:00.
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Cyflwyniad, Ymddiheuriadau, Dirprwyon a
Datganiadau o Fuddiant
Introduction, Apologies, Substitutions and Declarations of
Interest
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[1]
Dai Lloyd: Bore da i chi i
gyd. A gaf i alw’r cyfarfod i drefn—y cyfarfod
swyddogol cyntaf o’r Pwyllgor Iechyd, Gofal Cymdeithasol a
Chwaraeon yma yn y Cynulliad? Yn naturiol, croeso eto i chi i gyd
i’r cyfarfod cyhoeddus cyntaf o’r pwyllgor yma. A allaf
i egluro hefyd fod y cyfarfod yn ddwyieithog? Yn naturiol, gallwch
chi ddefnyddio’r clustffonau i glywed cyfieithu ar y pryd
o’r Gymraeg i’r Saesneg ar sianel 1 neu glywed
cyfraniadau yn yr iaith wreiddiol yn well ar sianel 2. A allaf i
hefyd eich atgoffa chi i gyd i ddiffodd eich ffonau symudol ac
unrhyw offer electronig arall, fel y mae’n dweud yn fan
hyn—nid yw e’n manylu—a allai ymyrryd
â’r offer darlledu, wrth gwrs? A hefyd, nid ydym ni’n disgwyl unrhyw beth
dramatig ynglŷn â thân, felly, os oes yna larwm
tân yn canu, mae angen dilyn cyfarwyddiadau’r tywyswyr
os bydd hynny’n digwydd. Gwnaf i nodi ar y dechrau fan hyn
nad ydym ni wedi derbyn unrhyw ymddiheuriadau. Symudwn ymlaen
felly. Byddai’n well i mi ofyn a oes rhywun eisiau datgan
buddiannau. Nac oes. Da iawn.
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Dai Lloyd: Good morning, everyone. May
I call this meeting to order—the first official meeting of
the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee here in the Assembly?
Naturally, I welcome you all here to the first public meeting of
this committee. May I explain also that the meeting is bilingual?
You can use the headphones to hear the interpretation form Welsh to
English on channel 1 or for amplification of the verbatim language
on channel 2. May I also remind you all to turn off your mobile
phones and any other electronic equipment—as it says here,
without specifying too much—that may interfere with the
broadcasting equipment? We don’t expect any dramatic event in
relation to fire, so if the fire alarm should sound, we need to
follow the instructions of the ushers. I will note at the outset
that we have received no apologies for absence. We will move on
therefore. May I just ask if anyone wants to declare an interest?
Nobody does. Very well.
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11:01
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Y Pwyllgor Iechyd, Gofal Cymdeithasol a Chwaraeon:
Blaenraglen Waith a Busnes Cynnar
Health, Social Care and Sport Committee: Forward Work Programme and
Early Business
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[2]
Dai Lloyd: Symudwn ni ymlaen,
felly, i’r ail eitem, sef y flaenraglen waith a busnes
cynnar. Byddwch chi’n cofio ein bod ni wedi cael trafodaethau
blaenorol a hefyd byddwch chi wedi darllen y papurau sydd gerbron.
Af dim ond drwyddyn nhw gogyfer y record. Mae’r papurau rych
chi wedi’u cael yn nodi rôl a chyfrifoldebau’r
pwyllgor yma a hefyd yn ein gwahodd fel pwyllgor gytuno ar
flaenraglen waith tymor byr. Felly, af drwy’r papurau os
ydych chi eisiau dilyn.
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Dai Lloyd: We will move on, therefore,
to the second item, which is the forward work programme and early
business. As you will recall, we have had previous discussions on
this and you will also have read the papers that are before us. I
will just go through them for the record. The papers that
you’ve received note the role and responsibility of this
committee and they also invite us as a committee to agree on the
short-term forward work programme. So, I will just go through the
papers if you would like to follow.
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[3]
Yn nhermau rôl a
chyfrifoldebau’r pwyllgor, mae gan y pwyllgor yma rôl
ddeuol o graffu ar bolisïau a deddfwriaeth o fewn ei gylch
gwaith, ynghyd â materion ariannol—felly, craffu ar
ddeddfwriaeth. Mae’r pwyllgor yma yn rheoli ei amserlen ei
hun, ond bydd yn destun terfynau amser a osodir gan y Pwyllgor
Busnes wrth ystyried deddfwriaeth. Yn atodiad 1, rŷch
chi’n gweld cylch gwaith manwl y pwyllgor yma.
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In terms of the role and responsibilities of
the committee, this committee has a dual role of scrutinising on
the policy and legislation within its remit, as well as financial
matters—so, scrutinising legislation. This committee is in
charge of its own timetable, but will be subject to the deadlines
that are set by the Business Committee when considering
legislation. In annex 1, you can see the detailed committee
remit.
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[4]
Yn nhermau rôl a
chyfrifoldebau’r Cadeirydd, mi fyddwch hefyd wedi darllen y
llythyr oddi wrth y Llywydd ataf i, fel Cadeirydd, sydd ynghlwm yn
atodiad 2. Mae hwnnw’n nodi disgwyliadau’r Cynulliad o
bwyllgorau a’r cymorth sydd ar gael i ni fel pwyllgor. Yn
nhermau, yn fyr, beth y byddwn i’n hoffi ei gyflawni fel
Cadeirydd, ac efo’ch cydsyniad chi fel pwyllgor, dros y pum
mlynedd nesaf ydy cael rhyw fath o symudiad ymlaen a gwneud yn
siŵr ein bod ni’n gallu diogelu gofal cynradd yn ein
gwlad. Hefyd, buaswn i’n licio mynd â’r maen
i’r wal ar lefelau ffitrwydd, achos mae’n rhaid i ni
beidio ag anghofio bod y pwyllgor yma hefyd yn edrych ar ôl
chwaraeon, ac mae’r ddau, wrth gwrs, yn cydweddu
â’r agenda iechyd.
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In terms of the role and responsibility of the
Chair, you will also have read the letter from the Presiding
Officer to me as Chair, which is attached in annex 2. That sets out
the Assembly’s expectations of committees and the support
that is available to us as a committee. Now, briefly, in terms of
what I’d like to achieve as a Chair, with your agreement as a
committee over the next five years, is to have some kind of forward
movement and to make sure that we can safeguard primary care in our
country. Also, I would like us to move forward in terms of fitness
levels, because we need to remember that this committee also has a
responsibility for sport, and both of them come together under the
health agenda.
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[5]
Felly, yn nhermau y pwynt nesaf ar
eich papurau chi—sut mae’r pwyllgorau’n
gweithredu—mae paragraff 8 yn eich papur yn tynnu sylw at rai
o’r elfennau allweddol a Rheol Sefydlog 17, sy’n
ymwneud â gweithrediad pwyllgorau.
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So, in terms of the next point on your papers,
which is the operation of the committee, paragraph 8 in your paper
draws your attention to some of the key elements there and Standing
Order 17, which is to do with the operation of committees.
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[6]
Symudwn ymlaen, felly, i gysidro
blaenraglen waith y pwyllgor. Mae yna restr o ymchwiliadau posibl
i’r pwyllgor eu hystyried yn gynnar yn nhymor yr hydref
wedi’i llunio ac mae hynny o’ch blaen chi yn atodiad 3.
Wrth gwrs, mae hyn yn seiliedig ar y trafodaethau anffurfiol y
cawsom ni fel pwyllgor yr wythnos diwethaf. Byddwn ni fel pwyllgor
yn cael cyfle i drafod y rhaglen waith tymor hwy yn nhymor yr
hydref.
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We’ll move on, therefore, to consider
the committee’s forward work programme. We have a list of
suggested inquiries for the committee to consider early in the
autumn term, and that’s been drawn up and is before you in
annex 3. This is, of course, based on the informal discussions that
we had as a committee last week and as a committee we will have an
opportunity to discuss our longer-term work programme in the autumn
term.
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[7]
Felly, yn nhermau ein gofyniad ni
bore yma fel pwyllgor, mae angen i chi gytuno ar y pwyntiau yma.
Mae angen i ni gytuno i nodi ein rôl a’n cyfrifoldebau,
sef paragraff 5 a 6. A ydy pawb yn iawn efo hynny? Diolch yn fawr.
Mae angen i ni gytuno ymhellach ar ein blaenraglen waith tymor byr,
sef paragraff 10 yn atodiad 3. A ydych yn hapus i gytuno’r
flaenraglen yna? Rwy’n siŵr y bydd yna ddigon o
hyblygrwydd yn y system i ni—. Julie ac wedyn Lynne.
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Therefore, in
terms of the requirements for us this morning as a committee, you
need to agree to these points. We need to agree to note our role
and responsibilities, which are in paragraphs 5 and 6. Is everyone
content with that? Thank you very much. We further need to agree on
the short-term forward work programme, which is to be found in
paragraph 10 in annex 3. Are you content to agree to that forward
work programme? I’m sure there’ll be plenty of
flexibility within the system for us—. Julie and then
Lynne.
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[8]
Julie Morgan: I agree with the programme; I think that’s
fine. What I wondered was, on all the different subjects that are
listed, and this is the initial committee work
programme—that’s what we’re discussing now,
isn’t it—and the sustainable NHS winter pressures, can
we be sure, when we consult stakeholders, that we consult patient
bodies so that we do actually have the patient experience of staff
shortages and all that sort of thing? I just think that it’s
quite important that we have that in all the elements.
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[9]
Dai Lloyd: Yes, indeed. Lynne.
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[10]
Lynne Neagle: Normally, we’d discuss the work programme in
private, so I don’t understand why this is in public. But I
did just want to ask: there’s a one-day session on
reconfiguration. I didn’t realise that we’d actually
agreed to do a one-day session on reconfiguration. I just wanted to
ask how that would work because I’m not really sure I can see
how it is possible to look at reconfiguration in a one-day scrutiny
session.
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[11]
Dai Lloyd: That’s a fair point. What we’ve got in
front of us now is what we sort of agreed informally last week. We
are going to go into private session to put some more flesh on the
bones now, in a matter of minutes. So, we’ll address the
other issues at that time, Lynne.
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[12]
Y trydydd pwynt sydd angen i ni
gytuno mewn egwyddor ydy rhoi amser o’r neilltu yn gynnar yn
nhymor yr hydref ar gyfer cynllunio strategol, sef paragraff 11 yn
y papur o’ch blaen chi. A yw pawb yn hapus efo
hwnnw?
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The third point that we need to agree in
principle is to put time aside early in the autumn term for
strategic planning, which can be seen in paragraph 11 in the paper
before you. Is everyone content with that?
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[13]
Rhun ap
Iorwerth: Pa dudalen?
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Rhun ap
Iorwerth: Which
page?
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[14]
Dai
Lloyd: Tudalen 4. Os oes unrhyw beth yr wyt ti am ei ychwanegu, fe
allwn ni wneud hynny pan rydym yn siarad yn fwy cyffredinol yn ein
sesiwn breifat.
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Dai
Lloyd: Page 4. If there is
anything that you’d like to add, we can discuss it more
generally later.
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[15]
Hefyd, y pwynt
olaf sydd gen i yn y fan hyn ydy i gytuno i nodi materion penodol
eraill i’w cynnwys yn y blaenraglen waith, sef paragraffau 12
i 14, sydd hefyd ar dudalen 4. Lynne.
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Also, the last point I have here is to agree
to note other specific issues to include in the forward work
programme, namely paragraphs 12 to 14, which are also on page 4.
Lynne.
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[16]
Lynne Neagle: I think your pages might be numbered differently to
ours.
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[17]
Rhun ap Iorwerth:
Yes. I was on page 5 there as
well.
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[18]
Dai Lloyd: Fe wnawn ni nodi hynny. Os yw pawb yn hapus i
nodi’r materion yna, awn ni i mewn i fanylion nawr pan fyddwn
yn ein sesiwn breifat, achos mae yna gwpwl o bethau eraill y mae
angen i ni eu trafod yn y sesiwn breifat er mwyn cadarnhau’r
ffordd ymlaen yn y cyfarfod nesaf yn nhymor yr hydref.
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Dai Lloyd: We’ll make a note of
that. If everyone is happy to note those issues, we will go into
detail now when we go into private session, because there are a few
other things that we also need to discuss during the private
session in order to confirm the way forward in the next meeting in
the autumn term.
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11:09
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Cynnig o dan Reol
Sefydlog 17.42(vi) a (ix) i Benderfynu Gwahardd y Cyhoedd o Weddill
y Cyfarfod Hwn
Motion under Standing Order 17.42(vi) and (ix) to Resolve to
Exclude the Public from the Remainder of this Meeting
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Cynnig:
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Motion:
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bod y pwyllgor yn penderfynu gwahardd y cyhoedd o
weddill y cyfarfod yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog
17.42(ix).
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that the committee
resolves to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting in
accordance with Standing Order 17.42(ix).
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Cynigiwyd y cynnig.
Motion moved.
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[19]
Dai Lloyd: Gyda’ch cydsyniad, symudwn ymlaen, o dan
eitem 3—. Nawr
yw’r amser i mi ein gwahodd ni fel pwyllgor i fynd i mewn i
sesiwn breifat ar gyfer gweddill y cyfarfod, yn unol â Rheol
Sefydlog 17.42(vi) a (ix). A oes unrhyw Aelod yn gwrthwynebu bod
gweddill y sesiwn yma’n mynd i fod yn breifat? Os ydych chi
yn anhapus, a fedrwch chi fynegi’r anhapusrwydd yna mewn
unrhyw ffordd? Os nad ydych yn anhapus, gwnaf gau yn swyddogol,
felly, y cyfarfod, ffurfiol cyhoeddus yma gan ddiolch i bawb am eu
presenoldeb a hefyd am y cyfieithu a’r gefnogaeth, gan
ddatgan y bydd cyfarfod nesaf y pwyllgor Iechyd, Gwasanaethau
Cymdeithasol a Chwaraeon ar ddydd Iau, 15 Medi 2016.
Yn naturiol, ddiwedd yr wythnos yma
mae’r Cynulliad yn codi am yr haf. Bydd Aelodau mewn
cyfarfodydd dros y lle i gyd, ac wedyn byddwn yn dod yn ôl i
gyfarfod y pwyllgor nesaf yma ar 15 Medi 2016. Diolch yn
fawr.
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Dai Lloyd: With your agreement,
let’s move on to item 3—. Now is the time to resolve as
a committee to go into private session for the remainder of the
meeting, in accordance with Standing Order 17.42(vi) and (ix). Does
anyone object to having the rest of the session in private? If you
are unhappy with that, please say so in any way you like. If
you’re not unhappy, then I will officially close this formal,
public meeting by thanking everyone for being present and also the
translation and support service. The next meeting of the Health,
Social Care and Sport Committee meeting will be on Thursday, 15
September 2016. Of course, at the end of this week the Assembly
will rise for the summer period. Members will be in meetings all
over the country, and then we’ll come back together for the
meeting of this committee on 15 September 2016. Thank you very
much.
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Daeth y cyfarfod i ben am 11.10.
The meeting ended at 11.10.
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